- Shadow Mamoswine dominates Ice types, and is a top-tier counter against Dragon and bosses, even though it’s often not the best (other types have better shadows and Xurkitree).
- While most uses for Ice types (Rayquaza and Landorus raids) are easy duos and only NEED L30 regular Mamoswines, having 6*L50 Shadow Mamoswines allows you to DUO MEGA Rayquaza!
- Shadow Mamoswine is also generally the best non-mega Ground type, edging out PB Groudon in practical use. However, it fares a lot worse when compared to competitor types, being worse than their shadows and legendaries. Luckily, there are several bosses where Ground is the only option.
- While regular Mamoswine is still a top-tier non-shadow Ice and one of the many great Ground types, it’s no longer competitive when compared to other types, even other non-legendaries. Evolve a cheap high-level non-shadow team if you don’t have one, but all resources should go into shadows.
- Even Ice-type Shadow Mamoswine can theoretically be outclassed by Galarian Zen Darmanitan, but its implementation is uncertain.[Part 3 TL;DR] The biggest and most realistic threat to Ice-type Shadow Mamoswine is Galarian Darmanitan Zen, which will be straight up better if it keeps the current GM moveset, but there’s a lot of uncertainty in implementation. On the Ground side, many shadows can surpass Shadow Mamoswine, as well as Landorus-T with a future signature move.
- Ice-type and Ground-type charts
- Pairwise comparisons involve Shadow and Regular Mamoswine
- Details on Mega Rayquaza duo and Mega Garchomp solo with Shadow Mamoswine teams
- Plots of Ice vs Dragon, and Ice vs Electric vs Rock
- Selected future Ice and Ground attackers
- List of my previous analyses, in Appendix
Regular Mamoswine is worse than all good non-shadow dragons, even as “low” as Dragonite, unfortunately. I’ll answer these questions with the following parts: [Part 1d TL;DR] Shadow Mamoswine is worse than shadow Dragon and Electric attackers, as well as Xurkitree and Zekrom. But it’s ahead of all Rock types, and still a top-tier option overall (the most accessible of all these). Regular Mamoswine is worse than non-legendary Dragon, Rock and Electric types (Dragonite, Rhyperior, Electivire/Magnezone), and is more like a filler if you don’t have 6 others.
Galarian Darmanitan (Zen Mode) has the greatest potential, by far. It has higher base attack than Mewtwo, and is already assigned Ice Fang/Avalanche in the current Game Master. Obviously that can change, but if it stays… We have a new Ice king on our hands, immediately outclassing Shadow Mamoswine by quite a bit. Note that these are only base on Pokebattler estimators averaged across all boss movesets. For many of them, the threshold can be crossed earlier with an easier moveset, or unable to be met with a harder movest – examples below. I first did this comparison when writing my Primal Groudon analysis. In fact, I’ll present the same comparison chart and the same explanations as last time: The way I see it, Ground attackers are very clearly divided into two tiers: Shadow Mamoswine leads the “Tier 1 Ground“ (with Groudon being the only contender – aka shadows and legendaries), while regular Mamoswine is part of the many “Tier 2 Ground“s (aka non-legendaries).- When Ice or Ground is the only option, is a 6*L50 shadow team really necessary? Or can you make do with cheaper teams, even wild-caught Level 30s?
- When Ice or Ground is not the only option, how does (regular/shadow) Mamoswine compare to attackers of other types? How often will you actually be using it on the field?
If you don’t dodge… Earthquake and Fire Blast can’t be soloed even at L50. But Sand Tomb (the easiest) can be soloed at L40, MS/Outrage is fine at L40, and DT/Outrage barely falls out (1.03). Level 50 Shadow Mamoswines can reliably solo Outrage and Sand Tomb sets.
- Part 1: Shadow and regular Mamoswine as Ice attackers
- 1a: Ice-type charts
- 1b: When is Ice required, and when is Ice usable but not the best?
- 1c: Short-manning thresholds – How high do you need to power them up to?
- 1d: Ice compared to other types: Dragon, Electric, Rock
- Part 2: Shadow and regular Mamoswine as Ground attackers
- 2a: Ground-type charts
- 2b: When is Ground required, and Ground compared to other types
- Part 3: Future considerations – Will Shadow Mamoswine ever be outclassed?
Yes, you read that right – Mega Rayquaza is a Mega Legendary raid that CAN be duoed! But only if both of you have SIX L50 Shadow Mamoswines (and are best friends). If you’re on desktop and want to jump to a particular part, search “Part X” or “Part 1c”. There’s also “Part X Verdict”, which are more condensed but still somewhat elaborate sections with more advice. Here are the comparison plots: Here is a line chart that shows all Ground attackers, but only when Ground is the best attacking type against the boss (mostly electrics and double weaknesses). In this scenario, Shadow Mamoswine clearly comes out ahead of Groudon. There are also minor changes in the scores of other Ground attackers, most notably Garchomp getting worse and regular Mamoswine getting somewhat better. [Part 2b TL;DR] 6 legendaries can only be countered by Ground (electrics and double weaknesses), a surprisingly high number – almost half of Ground‘s use cases. However, whenever another type can be used, Shadow Mamoswine falls behind other shadows and legendaries, while regular Mamoswine becomes worse than even many budget options.
Part 1a: Ice-type Charts
What are you waiting for with a top of its type? Go grind as hard as you can! Get those 2160 XLs to build 6 Level 50 Shadow Mamoswine! See ya!
The main role of Ice types in T5 raids is anti-Dragon and anti- . But Ice is never the only counter there, and in fact, it’s often weaker than most other counters. And yes, that applies to even Shadow Mamoswine – it’s weaker than shadow Dragon, shadow Electric, and Xurkitree. (Tyrantrum and Terrakion are omitted on the chart for clarity, but they’re around Electivire.)Regular Mamoswine vs. Galarian Darmanitan
First, I’ll mention an important caveat. Pokebattler does have Mega Rayquaza now, but it uses unnerfed stats. Most legendaries get a 9% nerf on top of that, but Primal Kyogre and Groudon only got a 3% nerf. Regardless of how Niantic deals with Mega Rayquaza’s stats, the actual raid will likely be easier than what Pokebattler tells you.
Part 2a: Ground-type Charts
You can now follow me (@teban54) on Twitter!
- Fact: Mud-Slap/High Horsepower is currently the best non-exclusive Ground-type moveset, as illustrated by u/Elastic_Space‘s metric, Moveset Specific Power (MSP). Yes, it’s better than Earth Power.
Outside of Rayquaza and Landorus raids, Ice types face quite a lot of competition in their main roles:
- The order I gave is a bit different from the chart, for several reasons. See sections below.
Note that I’d consider Shadow Mamoswine vs Zekrom a draw, but more in Zekrom’s favor due to estimator.
Shadow Mamoswine vs. Groudon
Regular Mamoswine vs. other Ground attackers
If you dodge, a team of L40 Shadow Mamoswines can already solo all movesets.
- Landorus-T seem to be just better than Mamoswine (it also has higher DPS and TDO).
- Garchomp‘s main advantage is its bulk and good typing (especially against Fire). It actually has lower DPS than Mamoswine, though higher ER. I’d still consider Garchomp better overall, but the cases where it shines are where you typically don’t want to use Ground types to begin with.
- Excadrill is a glass-cannon version of Mamoswine, with the same ER, higher DPS, and even some of the same drawbacks that Mamoswine face. While its Steel typing provides some nice resistances, it suffers from a similar amount of typing disadvantage as Mamoswine (Fire, Fighting, Ground). Most of my simulation plots show them as very close, for a good reason.
- Rhyperior has the lowest raw power, and relies on its bulk even more than Garchomp does. I’d say it’s the “worst” of the group, but still perfectly functional with only a small difference.
- Note that Mamoswine’s typing disadvantage shows up in all of them except Excadrill. In 10% of all cases, Mamoswine just collapses.
As long as you care about how well they perform in raids, even a 0% Shadow Mamoswine is a much, much better raid attacker than 100% Purified Mamoswine, if they’re powered up to the same level.
Part 2b: When is ground required?
It should be noted that the difference is not huge – typically 5%, or sometimes less.
Shadow Mamoswine is basically better. It performs the “traditional” duty of a Ground attacker better than Groudon does. Other than that, sometimes it does really badly due to typing disadvantages, but then Groudon isn’t the top counter either.
- I was actually surprised to see this number is almost as much as other current T5 bosses weak to Ground (8). In other words, nearly half the time when you can bring out Ground types at all, it’s the only option! Wow. I’m really surprised.
This gives rise to the main questions that I want to address today:
Ground compared to other types
[dround] attacks do have wide coverage, being able to hit 5 types for Super Effective damage. However, against the 4 types other than Electric, other attacking types are much stronger than Ground types (even Shadow Mamoswine).
This raises a question: Is powering up high-level Mamoswines really that necessary? Is my dust better spent on something else (like shadow dragons), if level 30 non-shadow Mamos seem enough?
Regular Mamoswine… Honestly disappoints, just like most other Ground types. Being worse than Machamp, Gyarados, Blaziken and non-shadow SD Tyranitar is just too bad in this day and age. Unless you lack a team of several other types, Ground types other than Shadow Mamoswine and Groudon are simply “must use Ground” specialists and team fillers.
Does this mean regular Mamoswine is useless now? Absolutely not!
Part 2 Verdict: Ground Mamoswine
[Part 2a TL;DR] Shadow Mamoswine is generally the best non-mega Ground, being slightly ahead of Precipice Blades Groudon in most practical cases, but it has some notable typing disadvantages. Regular Mamoswine is far behind Groudon, but within a whole pack of very similar Ground types below that (Landorus-T, Garchomp, Excadrill, Mamoswine itself, Rhyperior)
The good news is a Mega Rayquaza TRIO is fairly easy! Even 3 players with L30 regular Mamoswines can defeat Mega Ray, as longa as they’re best friends and dodge Outrage.
While the CD move Ancient Power has no use in raids, Mamoswine itself has been a staple as a raid attacker ever since it was released. Regular (non-shadow) Mamoswine had been the best Ice type for years, then Shadow Mamoswine took over for another few years, and since Mamoswine received High Horsepower in December 2022 (obtainable with regular Charged TMs), it can even function as a great Ground type! Today, Shadow Mamoswine remains the #1 Ice AND Ground attacker (generally).
- Don’t have too many dedicated top-tier teams built;
- Prefer to use unique counters;
- Get sunny weather boost a lot; OR
- Can coordinate with a friend to run a Primal Groudon in the party (which provides the 30% mega boost even if it’s not currently on the field)
Impressions:
Future and speculative Ice-type attackers
- Another uncertainty is how the form is implemented: permanent form or an in-battle form change? So a lot of uncertainty surrounding this one.
Non-shadow Mamoswine obviously can’t touch its own shadow self nor Precipice Blades Groudon (though it’s quite comparable to Earthquake Groudon, which we’ll omit here). But it’s very similar to most other prominent Ground attackers: Landorus (Therian), Garchomp, Excadrill, Mamoswine itself, and Rhyperior. How does Mamoswine compare to each of them?
- Note that there’s only one single Ice-type move in Kyurem’s MSG moveset that can still become a fast move: Freeze-Dry, and that’s a rather unlikely outcome. But theoretically possible.
- Between Shadow Mamoswine and regular Mamoswine: Kyurem with Ice fast move, and Black Kyurem with its current GM moveset.
- Similar to Shadow Mamoswine: Black Kyurem with Ice fast move.
- Better than Shadow Mamoswine: Black Kyurem with Ice fast move and signature charged move.
[Part 1b TL;DR] Only 2 legendaries (Rayquaza and Landorus) NEED Ice, out of 13 that are weak to Ice. Outside of those and Electric/ (Zapdos, Thundurus), even Shadow Mamoswine falls behind other shadows.
Future and speculative Ground-type attackers
Here’s a Pokebattler link set to L50.
These are the only cases where Ice types are the only viable counters. 2 T5 raids, out of 13 currently released.
- Volcarona, Kleavor and Mega Pinsir: All of them as bug types, Volcarona as fire, and possibly Kleavor as rock depending on moveset. Will likely only start working once Kleavor has been added to GM and thus Pokebattler.
- Quick analysis on Blast Burn Delphox for May CD, assuming leaks are true.